Back to the Future

First question - I think I will using Sweet16
or maybe Kegs but I do not know. How do you
save programs in an emulator? I have used one
before but only to load programs.

read the Help pages....
If you load files in Applewin from the disks you may also save there files
with regular DOS-Comands either to Drive 1 or to Drive 2 depending to the
syntax and OS you have loaded ( DOS, Pascal or ProDOS )....
Default assembler for Apple II+ and IIe is Merlin ( 8 Bit Version ).

2nd question - Are there other versions of Basic
that support Shape Tables for Double Hi-REs? I am
looking to do animation but I cannot find much
documentation for the IIe on this. I have been going
throught the IIe techincal manual and know that it
the memory map for DHGR interweaves between the aux
memory and main memory but cannot find examples
of this being implemented in coding.

I´d recommend to download some stuff from the beagles rspository:

beagle.applearchives.com/the_software/vintage_beagle_bros_softwar/

It´s a good idea to pickup from there the
Big TIP Book
Global Program Line Editor,
Beagle Graphics Disk
Beagle Tip Disk
Alpha Plot
and
Shape Mechanic
The Beagle Bros. had the good habit of distributing their software
with excelent internal documentation ( commenting inside of the code )

at the User Groups the was in Germany a section the was developing a own Game Programming Language

depending to the language you speak natively there are also a bunch of books and
magazines availiable with excellent chapters related to the use of ampersand-commands
and Graphics....

For example the magazine Peeker in Germany had a bunch of articles related to the stuff
as well as in english language the magazine Nibble.

The one aspect is the switching between the front 64 kB Bank and the AUX- 64 kB Bank,
and second is the switching in that banks between use of Lores, Hires, mixed Hires and DHGR Pages.

Anothzer Hint: At the International Apple Core ( IAC ) the top level user org that linked
national user groups together - the was a project called EAMON - this was what you would
call nowadays the first "open source" project ever at the Apple platform where in various
countries guys shared open documented code together and developed a gaming platform.
That project contains nearly 80 disks of open source code !

Does anyone have any experience of pointers in this direction?

see previous explenation.

Sound - I would like write tunes for the graphics in
assembler or basic but need a little more information
that the tech manual.

The Beagle Brothers had some small bit of documented soundsoftware too.....
Larger bits of documented explenations can be found a german Peeker magazine and at the US magazine Nibble....
the stuff at Nibble is rather more spread over a wide range of articles related to programming game
and it´s a good idea to take a inside view to the programming from Apple Organ and the SAM software....
and some hints are also availiable at the Beagle Brothers utilities...

speedyG

This time I will be using an emulator on my Mac.

First question - I think I will using Sweet16 or maybe Kegs but I do not know.

If you want to emulate your Apple IIe, you will want to use Virtual II (http://www.virtualii.com/). Only if you want to emulate a IIGS would you use Sweet16 or GSPort (or KEGS).

How do you save programs in an emulator?

You generally have a "disk image" (which is a file in the real world, representing what used to be a physical floppy disk). You treat that disk image just like it's a floppy disk... you can load and save stuff to it, depending on if it's got room or not. You can use game disks (like you already have done), or you can use plain old DOS boot images to start up the emulator and do DOS/BASIC-based load and save operations on it. So just like you had a box of disks sitting next to your Apple - you have a set of disk images that hold on to your games, files, and so on. Depending on the emulator, you indicate which disk image you want to "insert" into the virtual disk drive, and off you go.

Virtual II, AppleWin, Kegs (and GSport), and Sweet16 are all good emulators, and they all emulate Double High-Resolution of the IIe (rev b) and up.

at the User Groups the was in Germany a section the was developing a own Game Programming Language
Is this still up and running? If so what is the web address?

this ended at 1989. But there are a bunch of user magazins that contain that stuff.
for more explenation read next part of reply too...

depending to the language you speak natively there are also a bunch of books and
magazines availiable with excellent chapters related to the use of ampersand-commands
and Graphics....

I take it that this is from the above users group, I would like to access there
books and magazines to find about Graphics. If not where can I find this info?

nope it´s not only User Group stuff....
see answer below...

For example the magazine Peeker in Germany had a bunch of articles related to the stuff
as well as in english language the magazine Nibble.

Again, do you have links where I can find/access?

Just to give a short reply:
here listed only the single editions from Nibble from 1980 to 1983 that have articles and series related to the topic: Graphics, shapes, Ampersand and sound:
1980 No.2
1981 No.1
1981 No.2
1981 No.3
1981 No.5
1981 No.6
1982 No.2
1982 No.3
1982 No.7
1982 No.8
1983 No.2
1983 No.3
1983 No.4
1983 No.5
1983 No.6
1983 No.7
1983 No.8

and this list can be continued nearly endless from 1984 till 1992 from Nibble ....- or if i also add those editions from peeker and other magazines....
first source for Nibble should be:

http://www.nibblemagazine.net/

and second source should be at:

http://mirrors.apple2.org.za/ftp.apple.asimov.net/documentation/magazines/

just besides another short explenation to the term ampersand:
in former days a lot of guys added powerfull machinelanguage programms to the Applesoft Basic language and
thereby permit to use own "homebrew" machinecode commands from to programs written with applesoft and
thereby permitting the apple to faster action at the graphics screens than with normal applesoft programs.

within the above listed issues there are also editions related to sound making with the apple without use of special soundcards but instead only using the internal speaker ....

the second given link also contains a level that has hundreds of user magazins availiable...
so search and seek....

I´m not up to these topics now at the moment anymore - after more than 30 years ago -
and i´m not willing to search for hours to provide you with every link you might like to have....
that would take several days and it´s up to you to perform your own homework....
Up to this point there is only one important link you will need to search nearly all
archived former stuff from Apple availiable at various archiving sources:

http://mirrors.apple2.org.za/

from that point you may enter 10 large important internet archives and there you also will find entire scanned books and magazines ( regular or from user groups ) including images from related disks....

one other important link is to the EAMON sources:
http://mirrors.apple2.org.za/apple2.caltech.edu/games/eamon/
and :
http://mirrors.apple2.org.za/ground.icaen.uiowa.edu/Eamon/

sincerely speedyG

Well the problem with Nibble is rather simple...
its a legal issue...

like you recognized at the site about Nibble the entire set of all magazines and all years
is still distributed by the publisher himself ( Harvey ) as OCR-scans.
And among the Apple Users there is very high respect to him, because
he really supported the community of users in fantastic way by publishing the magazine.
So of course nobody wants to harm his legal rights.....
It´s a kind of his "retirement fund" to distribute the entire collection of annual issues
by selling that DVD´s.
But you may believe me that that 2 DVD´s are worth each single Cent !

There are hundreds of articles related in details to all the above listed topics
with source code printed at the magazin and containing a lot of inside commenting
and you will save days of time because you don´t have to typ in that cade but instead just
create the related "disk of the month" of that month from the included archive of diskimages
and then loading the complete ready to use code.

The problem with Peeker is that ( up to my knowledge ) only 3 guys in Germany have ever performed that task
of scanning the entire 8 years and all single magazines ( and i´m one of that guys ).
Up to the moment there still is a unsolved question of the ownership of the rights.....
that prevents us from uploading at the moment that entire bunch of PDF-files.

But at least there is a possiblity at the moment to download the disk-images from Peeker.
( i just would have to look where that bunch ist stored in the public accessable archives....)
among that bunch there are 2 disks specially dedicated to use of hires graphics ....
The point is that that programs at that disks have excellent inside programm commenting,
explaining what part of code ececutes which kind of task....
(again i would have to look in the archives to list exactly the 2 disks...)
(and again of course i have the original disks but it´s same problem like with Nibble )

Today i just stumbled accross the image of the game language ( refered in previous posting ):
http://mirrors.apple2.org.za/ftp.apple.asimov.net/images/programming/misc/

I really would advise you to spend one or two days in a well ruled public library
for some research puposes.... if you live close to a town with a university the better it would be...
most universities have excellent sorted catalogs of the books in the library ( even backward to the 70´s )

and of course you also will need some patience watching ebay and scanning at amazon former old books
by title or by ISBN No. ( that are the International Standard Book Numbers )
of which every book has
an individual coding.... There is quite often a chance to get such books by entering the ISBN No. of the
correct title at amazon and getting a used issue from store that also deal with used books.....
at affordable prices...

finally in this directory:
http://mirrors.apple2.org.za/ftp.apple.asimov.net/images/productivity/graphics/misc/
you might find several disk images that you would like to generate a regular disk from.

I´ve mentioned it in a previous poisting, but i repeat it here fionally one more time:
at:
http://mirrors.apple2.org.za/ftp.apple.asimov.net/documentation/programming/basic/
you should pick the entry :
Graphically Speaking.pdf
and click at it for download to your disk.
Read it !
together with the notes :
Applesoft Hi-Res Routines.txt
from same directory will be a good start to the topics related to the HiRes graphics....

sincerely speedyG

Abebooks.com is a great source for used books (I have bought many manuals and other Apple II and Mac books from there)

While many of the same bookstores sell through Amazon, not all of them do and often the prices are even cheaper on abebooks than on Amazon (not always, but more often than not)
Zan

Did not realize you were looking for PDF files, figured we were just talking actual books (I personally hate reading on a tablet or computer screen unless I have to)

Not sure what books you were looking for. I've never bought any books from India from Abebooks and never seen photocopies in binders.
I've bought dozens of original Apple manuals, programming and "How to" books from the site for the Apple II.

Have you exhausted the supply of PDF files on Asimov?
ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.net/pub/apple_II/documentation/programming/basic/
ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.net/pub/apple_II/documentation/programming/6502assembly/
ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.net/pub/apple_II/documentation/programming/65816_gs/

Another good place to try, and easy to navigate, is http://apple2online.com/
Sometimes I find things there I missed trying to sift through asimov.

Put up the list of books you are looking for, there is a good chance some on here might already have them (I for one would gladly send you some books to keep as long as you needed if I happened to have them) you never know, you might get lucky.

Best of luck finding the stuff you are looking for.
Zan

Zan

And that's about it. I hope I get lucky.

You just got a little lucky!!

I have three of the titles you listed on the shelf in my office. I will check my storage unit after the weekend (not off work again till Monday)
and see if I have any of the other titles.

here are the Assembly Language books I currently have, and as I said three of them are on your list.
Zan

Here's one of your books on abebooks.com

It's $29 shipped (within the US) but that was just the second search I did and it popped up.
Used Library book from 1986.

There's a first edition, first printing copy of My. Cohen's "3d Animated Apple" but at $150 I'd say let's look for a PDF :bigsmile:

At least we know some of the titles are available, even if they may be a bit pricey.
Zan

an,

I just seen Graphics And Animation On The Apple II, II+, IIe and IIc
up on eBay.

Steven

an,

I just seen Graphics And Animation On The Apple II, II+, IIe and IIc
up on eBay.

Steven :)

Yep, but at $85 or best offer he could buy 3 of them from abebooks!!! (I had seen the same thing, which is why I looked it up on abebooks...couldn't remember where I had seen it)

However, Machine Level Programming is also on abebooks.com

Zan,

Yep. She's a bit steep, isn't she? lol

Steven

Zan,

Yep. She's a bit steep, isn't she? lol

Steven :)

Not as steep as this one on abebooks.com!!

(actually a couple of the other ones I linked to had even more ridiculous copies for sale as well. Tyope the author in a search then type "apple" (no quotes) in the 'search within these results' field.

Saw a couple $500 and $600 copies for a couple of the books on his list.

HOLY $H!T
Zan

Hello wishtoknow,

well i´ve spent last week several days in my "dungeons" ( part of my archive ).
i´ve picked up several anual collections of the niobble magazin and the peeker magazin
and spent several days at the scanner. In the mean time i´m nearly finished with that task.

So at the moment there is a pile of several hundred pages related only to Hires graphics
and ampersand routines as well as assembler-listings related to specific graphic routines....

Within the next days i´ll setup a bunch of several dozends of HTML-pages at my site related
to the topic of making and manipulating shapes and hiresscreens and other tasks related
to programming of games and making sound by software with the Apple without use of additional
hardware - only using the internal speaker....

Due to the fact that the publications have been made in different languages i will indicate
the contributions by flagging the languages in the content list page like i did with earlier
contributions. Even if you are not familiar with the German language it´s recommended to also
view that pages too, because there are valuable hints within the well documented programs.

After all the topic of making sound and graphics with the Apple is of general interest
leads to this task.
The result should be a kind of basic reference to programming of graphic pages.

I´ll drop here a link after the pile of making the HTMLpages has been solved.

sincerely speedyG

Hello wishtoknow,

it´s a very common myth that - if you don´t know about something,
that you will be able to solve that "disability" by searching Google..
but it´s only a myth !

Most people forget that in the timeline
computing started in end of the 70´s - at this time people didn´t even think about Google...
early BBS systems started in the early 80´s - at this time people didn´t even think about Google neither...
early attempt of Internet started in the late 80´s - at this time people didn´t even think about Google neither...
Searchmachines started in the mid 90´s - this was the time Google started up from the "bare bone"

So from end of the 70´s till mid of the 90´s there has been in general what you may call
"printed communication"... by libraries, by books, by BBS notes, by Magazines

If you search Google for information prior of the mid 90´s
you will only get results if somebody scanned and published that information
at his site...
otherwise you will view a very large dark black hole.....

- except you visit the location for "printed media" ...-> the library....
unfortunatly even libaries have the bad attitude that they kickoff
so called "outdated media" and ladies at that libraries have their
own opinion, what is to be called "outdated".... ( and i would disagree
with a lot of their decisions - because of thinking in lyrics and prosa
and not in technical terms )....

So for technical stuff the first and best source are still the libaries of the
"technical universities" like in the USA the MIT or Stanford....
i doubt if you would be able to find the same stuff in universities without technical
branch...
- and even there it might be required to enter the "dungeons of old storage archives"
in the "bomb-cave"

Most technical universities in former days had subscriptions of the "technical magazines"
of their era... ( sometimes even in foreign languages )
even then you would miss to get touch to the "digital information" of the era of the BBS
systems.... unless somebody stored the backups of that former communication systems...
in that days the information was stored in textfiles...

At the present moment for example my archives contain nearly 300 Gigabytes of stuff...
and only about 80 Gigabytes of that stuff is accessable by the "Apple Web Ring".

Just an example:
Windfall was the Magazin published by the British User Group. Later that magazine changed it´s name
to A+. That magazins have not been accessable unless i scanned that entire bunch and uploaded them
to asimov.

Just for information a snapshot to my archive directory of the magazines:

there are several directories without the preleading + sign indicating subdirectories....
that are directories, where i am still scanning that magazines and adding content to the
archives ( scanning every month about 20 to 30 magazines ) - or they contain "digital media"
from BBS systems.... some magazines have only been distributed by BBS systems....

and i am not talking at this point about books or documentation....
I still have somewhere in my dungeons the entire printed source code from UCSD system
( 6 binders with nearly 4000 pages of commented listings ) which is the preliminary
source code for UCSD Pascal and other compilers running at the so called "p-system".

anyhow... scaning material for that digital archive is still a time-eating task that
will demand several more years .....

and besides i also have other tasks running.... so patience and health will be demanded...

with the snapshot above you will at least get an idea of what to search for...
and besides: the red underscore marks the correct name: It´s not the Apple apprentice...
it´s "the sorcerers apprentice" you have to look for...

I just repeat... you´ll have to dig deeper in the dungeons....
- otherwise you´ll have to be patient till i upload the new pages to my site within
the next 2 weeks....

just a remark besides... when i started my site it was first edited in Germn language...
about 2 years ago i started to switch to english language.... so it´s recommended to
first look at the language flag to recognize in which language that page has been designed...
if you stumble across page with missing contents - thats result of change at the hosting
company and the move from one site to another... in such case just drop here private message
with the correct adress and i will try to correct as soon as possible...

sincerely
speedyG

Speedy,
Did (or have) you compressed this archive for sharing? Looks pretty awesome.
If so, can you PM me or post the link?
Also, I notice you're still running Windows XP. For a reason?

Hello macnoyd,

i´m sorry... at the moment that archive is not public accessable....
that 300 GB is allready after compression.... without it´s more than 500 GB....

there are several reasons:

1st reason : copyrights
there still is a large bunch where the copyrights are not clearly regulated

2nd reason: space
my site is limited to 5 GB space
i would need to have plenty space ( better a complete server ) at the internet...
i can´t afford that cost

3rd reason: contract with telecommunication company for speed and no limitation in downloads
that server would demand to have a highspeed connection to the internet ( T1 or better )
to make downloads affordable at acceptable speed....
otherwise you would need weeks for download....
( i transferred for backup purpose once that bunch to another server at other location
with highspeed DSL line - it took 1 1/2 weeks ! )

But i have taken precautions that the harddisks* will be copied and sent by airmail
to 2 different large sites in the Apple Web Ring if i pass away....
* in fact it´s not harddisks it´s an array of RAID5 harddisks

4th reason:
huge portions shall be translated from German language to english language....
and that is still an unsolved task....
i am just fighting to keep at lest all new contributions in the Applebox at least in english language...

5th reason: organisation
i am trying to get portions relocated in the directory structure....
for example 1 Dir 1 Game in that dir all manuals, all disks, all screenshots, all patches, all cheats etc. ....

i guess you now recognize the amount of problems related to that archive and i haven´t even listed all problems...

but on demand i select small portions and add them up in my site....

at the moment related to the topic of hires mentioned here
i will make several dozends of new pages in my site that contain about several hundred printed pages
with listings, source code, text and diskimages....

so just please be patient with me...

sincerely speedyG

Bob Bishop wrote several of the very early graphic and speech synthesis software for the Apple 1 and Apple II.
He became a developer engineer at Apple and joined several projects of his interest.

One of the first demoprograms of graphic capabilities of the Apple II
was written by him ( Applevision ) as well as several arcade games.

Apple II Manual Apple Machine Language Don Inman Kurt Inman 1981 Reston Publish
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Apple-II-Manual-Apple-Machine-Language-Don-Inman-Kurt-Inman-1981-Reston-Publish-/161796566528?hash=item25abd3ae00

Apple II Manual Apple Machine Language Don Inman Kurt Inman 1981 Reston Publish
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Apple-II-Manual-Apple-Machine-Language-Don-Inman-Kurt-Inman-1981-Reston-Publish-/161796566528?hash=item25abd3ae00

Don't bother, you can buy it here from abebooks for $3.48 with free shipping!

Wish to know, I only have the books I showed you the photos of. I did not have any of the other titles you listed.
If you'd like to borrow any of them, send me a PM. You can keep them for months if you wish. If you'd like to buy them, send me a PM. you can keep them forever! :bigsmile:
Zan

Hello wishtoknow,

i´ve started with the upload of the pages related to
hires graphics
sound at the apple II
ampersand routines
macro routines
and several related topics.
with in the bunch uploaded yet is the minor part in German language
and the major part in English language
the contributions are indicated by language flag at end of the line
at the moment there is a small restriction: i haven´t verified at the moment all diskimages.
So in some cases the diskimages contain also stuff not related specially to the single
contribution. In the other cases if the diskimage only contains very few files then that
diskimage has been verified and the files are really allocated to the specific contribution.

Due to the resolution of most monitors used with internet browsers some parts of the
source codes might be difficult to read. Specially for theat reason i have generated PDF-files
with far higher resolution, that will enable the visitor to download the PDF.file from the link
at the end of each page and permit a reader to zoom for readable size while reading that file
or for better readable printouts.

At the moment the site :
http://www.appleii-box.de/
contains the contributions from 1980 to 1983.
1984 will be added within next 14 days.
within next month i will try to add also 1986 to 1988/89.

Up to the current moment about 900 to 1100 printed pages have been added....

with the next bunch there will also be a contribution using the Apple 2 as synthisizer
allthough there are allready 3 other contributions related to that topic -
but with one difference: the formerly added contributions realy are extended project that also demand
making of additional hardware for use as synthisizer... the new contribution won´t demand such additional
hardware. There are also seveeral contributions about making sound with the Apple.

Untill you get further books from your booklist i guess it´s not wasted time to view the site
and the contributions uploaded yet to start with learning how to make shapes at the Apple and
how to move or manipulate that shapes and some programs for making and editing shapes and
hires screens ( including the source of that programs ) and startup of working with ampersand
routines and by that speeding up speeding up graphics with assembler routines.

sincerely speedyG

So finally i´ve uploaded today the rest of the bunch, that has been scanned
currently. So at the moment there will be a quite large period till another
major bunch will be uploaded.

Like explained in previous posting i didn´t have the time to check the disks -
so only part of the files has a link to disks with fitting content. At least
the really large programs 2 Games and 8 Applications are with the fitting diskfiles...
but a larger bunch of "smaller" programms still must be typed..... this may even stay
valid after checking out the diskarchives due to the fact that not all contributions have
been added and distributed with the related disks....

The 2 Games have been published together with the series of "Workshop" contributions
and contain in their code large portions of the other pages from that Workshop.
Like explained also several other contributionhave been uploaded that have
relation to Apple II and making of Sound and use of Ampersand commands.

so have fun

I´m locked up in the mext weeks with other tasks that are timeeating and
fixed to deadlines so that next major update and addings to the site won´t
happen before Christmas time in Winter.....

But if anybody discovers mistakes or bad links it would be nice to report
them to me here by pm. I will collect that messages and try to carry out
corrections as soon as possible.

speedyG